The Polygraph Place

Thanks for stopping by our bulletin board.
Please take just a moment to register so you can post your own questions
and reply to topics. It is free and takes only a minute to register. Just click on the register link


  Polygraph Place Bulletin Board
  Professional Issues - Private Forum for Examiners ONLY
  discussion of survey results and 'not a lie detector'

Post New Topic  Post A Reply
profile | register | preferences | faq | search

next newest topic | next oldest topic
Author Topic:   discussion of survey results and 'not a lie detector'
detector
Administrator
posted 03-25-2004 10:55 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for detector   Click Here to Email detector     Edit/Delete Message
This was an email dialogue between myself and ebvan based on my comments of the survey results I posted in the last Relevant Issue. Would love to get more feedback on the issues raised.

EBVAN WRITES:
You must be a glass half empty kind of guy. According to your numbers 38.81% feel polygraph is reliable or extremely reliable. 69.58% feel it is better than chance. NOT SO BAD. An optimist looks at a glass and says it's half full. A pessimist says it's half empty. The logical mind looks at the same data and notes that the glass is much bigger than it needs to be.

RALPH REPLIES:
On the contrary, I consider myself a positive person. So positive, that I don't settle for 'just okay', which is how I viewed these numbers. Especially when the gap between perception and reality is pretty vast if you view these numbers in light of actual accuracy.

The more the public has this perception, the harder our jobs are.

With that said, I'm admit to being a little negative about the future of polygraph if we as a profession do not work harder at changing this perception. The days of 'mystery' in polygraph are over and this is a new day where people are getting more informed.

EBVAN REPLIES:
With Ricki Lake, Oprah (ever notice her name is HARPO spelled backwards?) and shows like Meet the Parents providing the majority of the information forming the public perception, what should we expect? This is aggravated by examiners who willingly bastardize the process in the name of showmanship. Couple that with the long held tendency for good examiners to shroud the function of polygraph with an air of mystery as well as using trick stim tests as an easy way to psychologically set their examinee, then I am somewhat surprised that we are doing so well.

I think a good examiner should be able to truthfully explain both the psychological and physiological aspects of polygraph in terms a bowl of pudding can understand. We need to strip back the cloaks of magic and mystery and really educate the public as to what we do. I wonder how many examiners are willing to tell their subjects that the polygraph doesn't detect lies, it just monitors physiological reaction. I do this in my own little section of the world 2 or 3 times a year. I teach classes to citizens police academy and Youth Police Academy as well as give them a real world demonstration in which I let class evaluate the charts. Once they have identified the bad guy, which they always have, they have a new appreciation for what polygraph is and does.

Poll that group and I'll bet you cup of coffee the survey numbers rise.

Our organizations, APA, AAPP, etc. should be doing more in the public sector to promote the accuracy and validity of polygraph, but each examiner should also be putting forth some effort in their own area to properly educate the public.

RALPH REPLIES:
Now that's the sort of passion I Appreciate. I fully admit that I don't have enough real world experience to have the full understanding of how to conduct an exam not shrouded in a bit of mystery or the ramifications of doing that, but I'm certainly willing to be educated.

As to your question about telling thhe subject that polygraph doesn't detect lies, just physiological responses, have you done that and what is the response of the examinee when you do so?

EBVAN REPLIES:
I don't know that I am looking for a particular response when I tell someone that the polygraph doesn't detect lies, but I explain it by stating ( and it will be shorter here than in my pre-test) that the psychological conscious act of telling a lie ultimately generates a measurable physical response. Generally, I further explain that there is a lie detector in the room, but it is located in the examinees mind and I simply use my instrument to detect when it has activated. This is all part of a detailed explanation of Fight, Flight, or Freeze, as the brains response to danger, its physical manifestation and how that relates to intentional deception.


PLEASE POST YOUR OWN THOUGHTS ON THE ISSUES RAISED IN OUR DISCUSSION. THANKS.

------------------
Ralph Hilliard
PolygraphPlace Owner & Operator
http://www.polygraphplace.com


IP: Logged

Barry C
Member
posted 03-25-2004 02:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Barry C   Click Here to Email Barry C     Edit/Delete Message
I agree with EBVAN. I explain the fight or flight response in some detail, and I explain how common it is, along with examples. (It must be at a level appropriate for the examinee.) I further explain why the guilty person fears the question (detection and consequences), which results in an involuntary physiological response, i.e., the fight / flight response, recorded by the instrument. I explain the innocent person is not threatened by a question to which he is being truthful, and he therefore does not respond with the involuntary response I look for. I actually use the line that many people try to make polygraph out to be mystical and magical, and I explain the fact of the matter is that polygraph very straight-forward and simple. My theory is a person will be much more psychologically "set" - if there is such a phenomenon - if he understands what is truly a very rational and reasonable procedure. I think it builds rapport as well.

I don’t recall the study off the top of my head, but I could probably find it. In it the researcher (I believe it was Charles Honts) concluded that knowledge of polygraph did not influence the results – DI or NDI.

In essence, I treat every examinee as if he has read all the anti-polygraph literature, and I set him up by not doing what all the producers of those publications tell him to expect. Every one of them tells people a polygraph instrument does not detect lies, which we all know is true, but they all add we will lie by saying it does. What they do fail to tell people is how impossible it is for them to control the fight-or-flight response, but, as I said, I take care of that aspect.

(I also talk – or even casually joke – about CMs, including some of the most recommended techniques and how easy they are to detect. I’ve got an activity sensor that can pick up air pressure changes in the room, so there’s no way somebody is going to pull of a sphincter contraction without me seeing it.)

IP: Logged

All times are PT (US)

next newest topic | next oldest topic

Administrative Options: Close Topic | Archive/Move | Delete Topic
Post New Topic  Post A Reply
Hop to:

Contact Us | The Polygraph Place

copyright 1999-2003. WordNet Solutions. All Rights Reserved

Powered by: Ultimate Bulletin Board, Version 5.39c
© Infopop Corporation (formerly Madrona Park, Inc.), 1998 - 1999.